• Announcements

    • mario

      Live Auctions Every Saturday 2 pm to 7 pm Pacific

      Visit the Chatroom on the Forum Header to join the Sale
      2pm to 7pm Saturday
      Pacific time
      Great deal Live video feed for you to view the wood.Payments must be received with in 24 hours after invoiced. We will hold wood thats been paid for. There is no other option. mario
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
Rick Dingman

New Neck Angle Jig Build

10 posts in this topic

So since the humidity is high here and the all spruce is on stanby, Steve told me that there is always something to do, so i built a new neck angle jig.
I bought the templates from LMII and the first thing i did was make plexi copies. I'll keep the originals as masters.
[attachment=20425:008.JPG] [attachment=20421:001.JPG]
[attachment=20422:003.JPG] [attachment=20423:004.JPG]
[attachment=20424:007.JPG] [attachment=20426:010.JPG]

The changes i made to the obrian design is i made the jig wider by 4 inches, to give the guitar body more support when upright when checking the angle, and i added a Dial Gauge that can be located anywhere on the aluminum angle bar using a miniature c clamp.
[attachment=20427:011.JPG]

This is another neck angle jig i bought a while back and modified from Jon Simpson off ebay. He sells it for $130.00 . i am putting this one up for sale or trade for wood (back and side set, top wood, fingerboards etc).
[attachment=20428:012.JPG] Edited by Rick Dingman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'm envious rick. Nice work. I could use one of those but it's one of those "luxury jigs" I have yet to find the time to make. I'm sure it would shave a few hours of messing around off the neck set of a build.

No dehumidifier in the shop? That's a long season of high humidity in your part of the country isn't it?

Cheers,
Danny

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
What's different between the LMII and Simpson jig? Just wondering.

Nice setup.



Edzard

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I built one in the spring to that same design; No I just have to use it hopefully will get time to play with it on the Mando's I working on. I'm just making the necks and have left lots off material for several tries to get it right. Good thing you posted because I was going to glue in the CF an now realize I need the slot to line it up..... Thanks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='DannyV' timestamp='1345308318' post='121209']
I'm envious rick. Nice work. I could use one of those but it's one of those "luxury jigs" I have yet to find the time to make. I'm sure it would shave a few hours of messing around off the neck set of a build.

No dehumidifier in the shop? That's a long season of high humidity in your part of the country isn't it?

Cheers,
Danny
[/quote]

Yes i have a great working dehumidifier/dehumidifier and cantral air exchanger, it's just that the house is brand new and the foundation/basement is not insulated yet. Also the cement can take up to 6 months to fully dry. i will likly insulate this week, and that should help out alot[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=3]. [size=4]Also this is not a luxury jig to me, but probably one of the most time saving important ones, especially with the addition of the dial gauge. with this you can dial in exactly the compensation for the tops flex with the strings on, i love it for this.[/size][/size][/font][/color] Edited by Rick Dingman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Edzard' timestamp='1345311067' post='121211']
What's different between the LMII and Simpson jig? Just wondering.

Nice setup.



Edzard
[/quote]

The Obrian/Woolson jig is all one jig for all operations, and the Simpson is 2 seperate jigs, one for neck tenon, and one for body mortise. The Obrian i like more because of it's sturdyness, but then again, i built it with 3/4" russian birch ply, super nice stuff for jigs. Also, the adjustmant mecanism of the Obrian design is way more easy to set accurately, where the Simpson i found not so easy( i will take pics of the two so you can see what i mean). Finally the Obrian style is made so you can fit a wide neck blank into the jig and it uses 2 toggle clamps to hold the neck in place. i modified the simpson jig to have a toggle clamp, because it came with a plywood caul that i didn't care for. They are both great designs, just depends wait you like, this is my preference and i am not advocating one or the other. Simpsons design is compact, thats nice but not a game changer in my opinion. Edited by Rick Dingman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Rick.
This may be a dumb question but "[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=3][size=4]most time saving important ones, especially with the addition of the dial gauge. with this you can dial in exactly the compensation for the tops flex with the strings on, i love it for this." How do you do this before you install the neck Or are you fitting the neck and stringing the guitar up before it is glued in?[/size][/size][/font][/color]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Phil Armstrong' timestamp='1345416506' post='121229']
Rick.
This may be a dumb question but "[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=3][size=4]most time saving important ones, especially with the addition of the dial gauge. with this you can dial in exactly the compensation for the tops flex with the strings on, i love it for this." How do you do this before you install the neck Or are you fitting the neck and stringing the guitar up before it is glued in?[/size][/size][/font][/color]
[/quote]

After talking to many luthiers at shows and ready books on construction, and building, i have a good educated guess of what i can take away from the measurement to compensate for this rise of the bridge, based on how stiff my tops are, due to thiskness and bracing, i also keep a building log book of all these measurments. i havent got it to an exact science, but im trying, heheheh ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[font="Arial"][size="6"][size=6][b]"After talking to many luthiers at shows and ready books on construction, and building, i have a good educated guess of what i can take away from the measurement to compensate for this rise of the bridge, based on how stiff my tops are, due to thiskness and bracing, i also keep a building log book of all these measurments. i havent got it to an exact science, but im trying, heheheh ;)"[/b][/size][/size][/font]
My confusion was that you were using the jig to do this. Let see if I have it right. You take the gig place the body on top with the bridge either taped on glued on and figure neck angle by bringing the Aluminum angle against it. At that point you take into consideration the stiffness in your to and compensate for it with more or less angle when on the end off the neck. In other words getting the neck angle from using the gig and then adding compensation for the stiffness off the top.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I do not place a bridge on the body, because the bridge is to thick at this point in construction, the fingerboard is not attached to the neck when i do this. i put the aluminum bar up against the body of the guitar at the heel block. i have already set the distance of the dial gauge to be at the bridge position. i then zero the dial gauge pointer with the face of the aluminum bar (the part of the bar you would normally take your measurement from). You must take into account the amount of doming of the top if any, to get the amount of fall away at bridge position. Then if i want a bridge of lets say 5/16" thick like mine, you take .3125" - .250" (fingerboard thickness at the center of the crown) = .0625". Then you account for the fall away distance between the bridge position and the dial gauge zero point (or your aluminum bar stock, at this point they are the same). Lets say the fall away is .095". so you add .095" + .0625" = .1575". Next we subtract .1575" from .3125", which gives us the neck angle measurement of .155". Finally if we know our top deflection at bridge point, we can add this number to the total. lets say the top deflection on previous instruments when strung up is .025". so .155" + .025" = .180" This would be the measurement you would dial in with the guitar body in place.

Now if you make the same model many times, just make a .1575" or .158" shim and put in in the bridge position. to set the angle without deflection comp or .180" with. These would not be exact numbers for everone, but for one specific model with specific bridge placement and doming.
Another point to make is that the rotational force on the heel block can be kept to a minimum by adding a fingerboard extension and a foot to the heelblock design, which extends all the way to the UTB and the foot to the backs first brace closest to the heelblock.

This is the top deflection gauge from stewmac, or they are easy to make.
[attachment=20462:Top_Deflection_Gauge_sm.jpg]

Here is a great article written by Hesh on the forum here on neck angle.
[url="http://www.lenaweelutherie.info/page6/page30/page30.html"]http://www.lenaweelu...e30/page30.html[/url] Edited by Rick Dingman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0